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Author Topic: Immigration  (Read 1144 times)
Tom Rubillo
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« on: June 18, 2018, 11:02:54 AM »

The administration policy of separating children from their parents is mean spirited, cruel, despicable, immoral and disgraceful.  Both US and international law protect the right of every person fleeing their home nation to ask for asylum in other  countries.  Prompt hearings to determine eligibility are supposed to be convened by the host country.  Meanwhile, while the entire family can be lawfully detained pending the hearing, conditions of confinement are supposed to be decent, safe and sanitary.  There is  absolutely no statutory or constitutional basis for separating children from their parents in these circumstances.  In fact, the US Supreme Court has previously ruled that the right of parents to raise their children free from unwarranted governmental interference is a right "older than the Bill of Rights."   That right  has been respected in all cases involving requests for amnesty for decades by all prior administrations, Republican and Democrat.  That, quoting the Bible as justification, Attorney General Jeff Sessions is now pandering to the worst impulses in the present administration and using children as "leverage" to get political concessions from Congress and to "discourage" amnesty requests.  The new found policy and practice of doing this flies in the face of the fundamental tenets of Christian faith and is, in theological fact, sacrilegious.  Just ask yourself this question:  Would it be okay if this were done to me and my children?  Those who would not want the same treatment done to them should not be willing to do it to others.  It  is  really that straightforward,  both as a matter of faith and as a matter of law.
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Marty Tennant
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« Reply #1 on: June 18, 2018, 11:29:03 AM »

Tom, where was the outrage when this was happening under the last administration?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/the_americas/mexican-kids-held-for-months-as-punishment-for-border-crossing/2015/03/10/311d319a-b2f2-11e4-bf39-5560f3918d4b_story.html?utm_term=.b9d0171f02cf
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Notice:  All posts made by me are my OPINION.  I am not responsible for any comments by others!  The Citizens' Report is provided as a public service to the citizens of Georgetown County for them to report and comment on the news.
Marty Tennant
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« Reply #2 on: June 18, 2018, 11:31:33 AM »

Here is another excellent source of info. Asylum is abused by those that are being coached by the open border advocates, including Soros and the ACLU.

It is fraud, pure and simple:

https://cis.org/Arthur/Caravan-Points-Out-Weakness-US-Border-Policy
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Notice:  All posts made by me are my OPINION.  I am not responsible for any comments by others!  The Citizens' Report is provided as a public service to the citizens of Georgetown County for them to report and comment on the news.
Tom Rubillo
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« Reply #3 on: June 18, 2018, 04:23:14 PM »

Amnesty decisions are made on a case-by-case basis, just like any other non-criminal matters coming before the courts.  Those making application are not to be prejudged or punished before the hearing.  Simple due process requires that they be given fair notice of the hearing and enjoy a reasonable opportunity to present their case.  Meanwhile, they have the right to consult with legal counsel prior to the hearing, so complaints about "immigration advocates" or the ACLU or the boggey man of the extreme right wing (George Soros) are not particularly persuasive.  Lawyers advise and advocate.  That's their job in immigration cases involving requests for amnesty, just like in any other case.  Regarding practices of prior administrations, there were very few prehearing separations of parents from their children in amnesty request cases  by prior administrations, Republican or Democrat.  The most reliable number I have come across so far is 18 instances in the preceding three years, and all of those involved situations in which there was an underlying, non-immigration related crime of which the adult parent stood accused and for which the parent had been placed in pretrial detention but unable to make bond for that crime.  In those instances the accused and his or her children were dealt with in the same way as happens in any other run-of-the-mill criminal case.  Kids are not put in pretrial detention with parents accused of the violation of criminal law.  If some other relative doesn't give them shelter, DSS steps in and places the child in foster care.  They are not housed in some tent city or in an old Wal-Mart without any idea of whether or when they are going to see their parents again.   Again, Marty, would you want anyone to do something like this to you.  You're a big church-going guy.  What did Jesus say about taking in strangers and dealing with neighbors?              I know that some people want to justify whatever Donald Trump does based on the mistaken belief that he and his administration can do no wrong.  Some people were that way about the Obama administration, the Bush administration before that, the Clinton administration before that, the other Bush administration before that, the Reagan administration before that, etc., etc., etc.   I'm not one of those, but follow facts where they take me and apply the law as I understand it to those facts.  But when it comes to presidents or any other elected official, in one way or another they all screwed something up.  That's because no elected official, President or otherwise is infallible or some sort of a Messiah, self-appointed or otherwise,  Donald Trump included.         My outrage now is because there are over 2,200 little children being detained in makeshift facilities faced with an uncertain future because of actions of adults.  That number keeps rising.  Their suffering is being inflicted purposefully as leverage to squeeze political concessions out of an otherwise dysfunctional Congress.  That is immoral, unethical, detestable and inhumane.  It may well also constitute a crime against humanity under international law.  The practice certainly does not enhance the reputation of the government of the United States of America around the world.  It does nothing to "Make American Great Again."  To the contrary.            Our nation has been a beacon of freedom for oppressed people around the world, at least up to now.  I, for one, do not consent to extinguishing that beacon.  After all, the Statue of Liberty says "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses longing to be free" not "I'm tired of your poor and huddled masses."     So, Marty, I respectfully disagree.  This policy and practice is wrong headed and wrong hearted and needlessly brings great discredit and shame upon our nation.     So I protest, as is my right as secured by the First Amendment of the United States Constitution.  You have opened a public forum for the discussion of public issues.  While I know that you own the soap box, that fact does not (or should not) require that everyone agree with you on every issue.  On this one, we disagree, thus my dissent.  You, of course,are free to advocate otherwise, as is your right.                    God bless America.  God bless the children whose only "crime" has been to accompany their parents on a journey seeking freedom and opportunity.
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Marty Tennant
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« Reply #4 on: June 18, 2018, 05:45:23 PM »

Not so sure about the references to my church attendance lately.

I can't address all your concerns, but I stopped trying to use the inscription on the Statue of Liberty as immigration policy long ago.

The parents are the problem, not Trump or the Congress.

It is inhumane to drag children all the way thru Mexico, without a visa to enter Mexico, and then approach a port of entry and say the magic words that you've been told to mutter.

If you live in a sub-human shit hole country, overthrow the current regime and make it better. Don't come knocking here expecting handouts and open arms. We have deserving children of our own, not to mention homelessness that is out of control.

We are not the promised land for all people in Central America and Mexico that want a better life.

Oh, and the women? They are routinely raped along the way. Not a good idea to risk rape and death to be told, sorry, we aren't taking anymore people at this time.

We are not the problem. The countries they come from are, along with their lack of will to risk everything to change their local circumstances.

If this sounds heartless, so be it. We are not the nanny state for the entire world. Anyone that tells you so needs to go live in Venezuela. They have a socialist paradise just waiting for you.
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Notice:  All posts made by me are my OPINION.  I am not responsible for any comments by others!  The Citizens' Report is provided as a public service to the citizens of Georgetown County for them to report and comment on the news.
Amazing2Me2
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« Reply #5 on: June 18, 2018, 07:36:17 PM »

Many of these people passed through other countries on the way. Why not stop there and ask for asylum? The reason is they wanted the dream of jumping line into the US.
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Marty Tennant
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« Reply #6 on: June 18, 2018, 08:10:51 PM »

Here's a good explanation from someone you wouldn't expect to give a straight answer.

https://twitter.com/JackPosobiec/status/1008843955407085574
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Notice:  All posts made by me are my OPINION.  I am not responsible for any comments by others!  The Citizens' Report is provided as a public service to the citizens of Georgetown County for them to report and comment on the news.
Tom Rubillo
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« Reply #7 on: June 19, 2018, 10:37:34 AM »

Marty,  we clearly aren't going to convince one another, so we'll simply have to agree to disagree.  I do agree with you that there need to be popular uprisings in countries (or counties) oppressed by dictators or controlled by criminal gangs. Meanwhile, however, those incapable of mounting that sort of effort because of a lack of arms, money,leadership ability or otherwise will continue to flee seeking safety just as they have throughout history.  Some from Central America may well stop along the way and resettle in Mexico.  I have no idea whether some do or not and, unless I miss my guess, neither do you or the others commenting on this post.  Either way, it is unreasonable to expect that people will stop fleeing from oppression and violence.  That's a reality of human existence and has been since  the beginning of time.  (Remember Moses fleeing from Egypt with people fleeing bondage?)     As far as the Statue of Liberty is concerned, if the poem etched on its base it doesn't reflect what America stands for, then it should be removed and replaced with a "closed" sign.  That would be the honest thing to do.  That, and everyone here that is not a Native America should go back where they came, returning to their native lands in reverse order of their arrival.  Being Italian, that would put me at the end of the departure line given that Columbus was from my old neighborhood, behind the Hispanics who sailed and navigated his three ships and those with ties to the Mayflower in front of them in the line.               The obvious point of this little bit of sarcasm is that we are a nation of immigrants and draw our strength from the incredible diversity of knowledge and experiences of all those who have come (and will continue to come) to these shores.  That's because America is populated by that part of humanity who had enough gumption and get-up-and-go to do exactly that -- to get up and go in search of peace, freedom and opportunity.  I understand that some people, when they get what they came for, want to shut the door behind them and keep others out.  I don't think that is a very Christian way of thinking or, on a more practical level, makes very much sense economically or otherwise.  Without an influx of new blood and new ideas, societies stagnate and, ultimately, die out.  I don't want that to happen here.  Unless I miss my guess, you probably don't either.   In either event, I welcome the tired, poor, huddled masses longing to breathe free.  I do because I, like everyone else in America, am the off-spring of "wretched refuse" as the Statue of Liberty describes us all.  Good bless America and everybody in it, no matter  when or how they got here.  We are all, after all, God's children. 
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Marty Tennant
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« Reply #8 on: June 19, 2018, 11:04:41 AM »

Well said Tom. I still believe that the shithole countries need to try harder, and die trying if need be. Freedom isn't free, and we certainly have plenty of homelessness and child poverty here to keep us busy for years.  Having said that, I am in favor of legal guest workers and naturalization of new citizens. I am opposed to the current gaming of the asylum system and illegal border crossing. The last time I checked, we still allow plenty of people to enter our country legally and to work with permits in jobs our own citizens won't do.
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Notice:  All posts made by me are my OPINION.  I am not responsible for any comments by others!  The Citizens' Report is provided as a public service to the citizens of Georgetown County for them to report and comment on the news.
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